Minutes of the 7 November 1999 Meeting
[Note: These submissions appear on the Mar 2000 LoAR]
Notes and Announcements
Future meeting dates are: 12 December 1999 (Christmas Party), 23 January, and
20 February, 2000.
Ghislaine beseeches help for GWW. Crescent also asks that you come out and
help with the war and specifically with the heralds activities at the war.
Eiríkr has opened an invitation to all territorial heralds to
accompany him and Astriðr at their elevation ceremony at GWW's opening
court, 9:30 a.m. Saturday morning. He wants "heraldic, ostentatious".
Master Manfried passed away this week. He was the original Bellows Herald
(Kingdom Field Herald) and he will be sorely missed.
Jeanne-Marie still has plenty of crash space for Coronation (Nov. 20).
Submissions Considered
- Þorfaster Varinsson Argent, a Norse serpent nowed sable and a
bordure rayonny gules
- Áengus O'Flaherty On a field patterned of a Holstein cow's hide
proper, a bull's head cabossed gules armed argent
- Úrsúla Gunnarsdóttir
- Calam Stiúbhard Per pale gules and argent, a death's head
counterchanged
- Callista Terèsa di Bèlla
- Cassandra Nicole Loustraunau; Cassandre Nicole Loustraunau
- Catrin ferch Madog
- Cecilia la Feconda Or, a bunch of grapes gules slipped and leaved
vert, on a quarter vert a sun Or
- Ciana Masina della Luna Azure, on a bend cotised argent three
crescents palewise gules, in sinister chief a natural tiger rampant argent
marked sable
- Culloch MacUalraig [Fieldless] A thistle Or
- Donnchadh Kethe
- Godfrey Baldwin Maul [Fieldless] Three swords in pall, hilts to center
conjoined Or
- Jeanne-Marie la Verriere [FIELDLESS] A jocelyn azure and Or, belled
Or
- Magnus Hrafnarson Per bend sable and azure, on a bezant a hawk volant,
wings elevated and addorsed to sinister sable
- Magnus Hrafnarson Argent, two dog's heads couped addorsed sable each
collared, collars joined by a chain fracted gules, a bordure azure
- Mairead MacLabhrain Argent, two bears statant erect
respectant sable and a chest proper a bordure azure
- Mivanou merch Deicyn Maur Per bend sinister sable and azure, in bend a
roundel between and conjoined in fess to an increscent and a decrescent and a
sun Or
- Mons Draconis, Canton of [Fieldless] A fishhook vert
- Mons Draconis, Canton of [Fieldless] A demi-wyvern vert issuant from a
tower gules
- Nicolette Isabeau d'Avignon
- Seth Alexander Kygheley: Thomas Dudley
- Sheereen al-Maghrebiyya
- Starkhafn, Barony of: Order of the Radiance of Starkhafn Checky azure
and argent, a pale sable overall a candle argent lit proper on a candlestick
Or
- Tengcesiygei Erdenitei Badm-a Cecegdelgereky
- Zhigmun' Broghammer
Altavia, Barony of
Seth Alexander Kygheley; Thomas Dudley (New Name Change)
- Name:
Name is from Ansteorra and was registered by Laurel in 12/93.
Thomas is found in [Reaney, P. H., and Wilson, R. M.; (1995),
page 443], and Dudley on page 144 ibid. We found a Thomas
Dudley in [; (1943) , page 445], born 1576, but we do not know if he is
famous enough to protect.
Upon passage of this new name, the submitter wishes his old name of
Seth Alexander Kygheley to be released.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL.
Calafia, Barony of
Culloch MacUalraig (New badge)
[Fieldless] A thistle Or.
- Badge:
- This badge is in direct conflict with the badge for Seonaid inghean
Sheathain, submitted on the Caidan LoI of 7/23/99.
BADGE RETURNED FOR CONFLICT
Godfrey Baldwin Maul (Badge resub Laurel)
[Fieldless] Three swords in pall, hilts to center conjoined Or.
- Name:
- The submitter's name was registered by Laurel (11/98).
- Badge:
- The submitter's previous badge, [Fieldless] A sword per pale Or and
vert sustained by two griffins combattant, that to dexter vert and that to
sinister Or, was returned by Laurel (1/99) for thin line heraldry. This
is a complete redesign.
BADGE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Jeanne-Marie la Verriere (Badge resub kingdom)
[FIELDLESS] A jocelyn azure and Or, belled Or.
- Name:
- Submitter's name was registered ???
- Badge:
- The submitter's previous submission, [Fieldless] A jocelyn azure and
argent, belled Or was returned for conflict. She has changed the
tincture to clear conflict. The College notes the existance of the badge,
[Fieldless] A jocelyn wreathed Or and vert with six bells Or (Barony
of Nottinghill Coill, Atlantia - 11/94). We count this as clear with a CD for
fieldless and one for the change in half the tincture of the torse and the
change in number of the bells from four to six is worthy of a second, if not
third, CD.
BADGE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Tengcesiygei Erdenitei Badm-a Cecegdelgereky (New Name)
- Name:
The submitter wishes a Mongolian name appropriate to the 12th C. His
intended name appears to mean Incomparable, Precious, Lotus Flower
Blossoming. All name elements are from Haltod, Hangin, Kassatkin and
Lessing ed., Mongolian-English Dictionary. Tengcesiygei is from page
892, Erdenitei from page 320, Badm-a from page 66, and
Cecegdelgereky from page 168. We have no evidence that the name is
properly constructed.
Our research into Mongolian name construction indicates that they should
be composed of at most three parts, a noun and up to two modifying elements.
We have no evidence that a name could be comprised of four elements, each of
which are multiple elements. We are returning this name so that the submitter
may provide evidence of the proper name construction. We recommend that the
submitter consult the following website: http://www.panix.com/~mittle/names/baras-aghur/mongolian.html
NAME RETURNED FOR LACK OF DOCUMENTATION
Zhigmun' Broghammer (New Name)
- Name:
- The submitter wishes to have a German, Anglo Saxon, or Norse name
beginning with "Z" which is a cognate of Sigmund. He was
able to find Zhigmun' in [Paul Wickendon of Thanet; (1996) , pg 280]
and dates to 1419. Broghammer was found in [, page 223] dating to
1445, and appears to mean from the village of Brogheim.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Darach, Shire of
Ciana Masina della Luna (Device resub kingdom)
Azure, on a bend cotised argent three crescents palewise gules, in
sinister chief a natural tiger rampant argent marked sable.
- Name:
- The submitter's name is on the Caidan LoI of 8/99.
- Device:
The submitter's previous attempt at registration of this device were
returned for conflict with the arms of Karin Jorgensdotter Eldhierta,
Azure, on a bend cotised argent three hearts palewise issuing flames to
chief gules (3/98).
The submitter has received a letter of permission to conflict. Crescent
notes that while this letter does not explicitly state that Karin
Jørgensdotter Eldhierta gives permission for this device, through its
argument that the two devices are not in conflict, Karin's grant of
permission is made clear, even though not explicit. Crescent recommends that
submitters use the suggested form for a letter of permission to conflict
found in the Admin Handbook.
DEVICE RESUB APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Dreiburgen, Barony of
Catrin ferch Madog (New Name)
- Name:
- Catrin may be found in [Gruffudd, Heini; (1980) , page 21] and
dates to 1555. ferch is the feminine patronymic. Madog may
be found on page 66 ibid.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Donnchadh Kethe (New name)
- Name:
- Donnchadh is found in O'Corrain and Maguire on pg. 76 and in Woulfe on pg.
181. Kethe is found in Black on pg. 388 under the heading of Keith.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Nicolette Isabeau d'Avignon (New Name)
- Name:
- Nicolette may be found under Nicolas in [Dauzat, A.;
(1951) , page 450]. Isabeau may be found on page 337 ibid under
Isabelle, and dates to 1385 from the entry for Charles VI
of France who had a wife of the same name. d'Avignon means from
Avignon, where the latter is a city in France which [Seltzer, L. E.;
(1952) , page 128] dates to 1309.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Mons Draconis, Canton of (Dreiburgen)
Mons Draconis, Canton of (Badge resub Laurel)
[Fieldless] A fishhook vert.
- Badge:
- Their previous submission, [Fieldless] A fish-hook couped vert barbed
gules, was returned by Laurel (11/98) for the non-period practice of
making the tip a separate tincture from the rest of the body. This redesign
corrects this by coloring the entire charge one tincture.
BADGE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Mons Draconis, Canton of (New badge)
[Fieldless] A demi-wyvern vert issuant from a tower gules.
- Badge:
- We note that there is no visual difference in the emblazon between a
demi-dragon and a demi-wyvern, and it might be plausible to consider this a
dragon when considering the canton's name, but the members of the canton wish
to have it blazoned as a wyvern in reference to the wyvern charges found in
their device.
BADGE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Heatherwyne, Shire of
Callista Terèsa di Bèlla (New Name)
- Name:
- Callista is found in [De Felice, Emidio; (1986) , page 97] as the
feminine version of Callisto. Terèsa is found in [De Felice,
Emidio; (1986) , page 342]. di Bèlla is found in [De Felice,
Emidio; (1978) , page 74] under Bèlli. We are uncertain
whether the accents are pronunciation guides from De Felice, or if they are
true accent marks for the Italian. The name construction follows an
appropriate pattern of "given name, saint's name, patronymic".
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Lyondemere, Barony of
Cassandra Nicole Loustraunau. Cassandre Nicole Loustraunau (Name Correction
Laurel)
- Name:
- The Caid Letter of Intent, March 12, 1990 submitted the above name with
the first name ending in "e", and documentation from [Withycombe,
E. G.; (1977) , page 59] to support that. Laurel registered the name with an
"a" in June 1990 without explanation of the change in spelling. The
submitter writes, "The lack of specific mention of the name change makes
me believe that this was simply an error on the part of Laurel or her staff
when compiling the LoAR. Assuming that this is true, and that documentation
from Withycombe is still adequate, there should be no reason according to the
rules of the College of Arms that my preferred spelling cannot be used... I
ask that you hear my appeal and change the records to reflect my preferred
spelling. Thank you for your time and consideration." We have checked
both the LoI and the LoAR mentioned and concur with her.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Naevehjem, Barony of
Úrsúla Gunnarsdóttir (New Name)
- Name:
- Úrsúla is found in [Geirr Bassi Haraldsson; (1977),
page 15], and Gunnarsdóttir is the feminine patronymic of
Gunnar found ibid, page 10.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Starkhafn, Barony of
Starkhafn, Barony of, Order of the Radiance of Starkhafn (Order name and
Badge resub kingdom)
Checky azure and argent, a pale sable overall a candle argent lit proper
on a candlestick Or.
- Name:
- Submitted as Radiance of Starkhafn. Radiance is found in the OED
on pg. 2403 dated to 1601 from Shakespeare Alls Well That Ends Well and 1605
from King Lear. The Order of Silence (Cardinale, Hyginus
Eugene,Orders of Knighthood, Awards and the Holy See Van Duren, unk) appears
to support this form of an Order name, although the use of an abstract noun
appears uncommon at best. Some form of designator, e.g., "Order of"
is required with an order name. Crescent has added the designator.
NAME AND ORDER BADGE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Þorfaster Varinsson (Device resub kingdom)
Argent, a Norse serpent nowed sable and a bordure rayonny gules.
- Device:
- The College cites the the arms of Reynard the Brown (10/82) Argent, a
Norse serpent nowed sable encircling in its upper loop a maltese cross
gules. We believe that it is clear with one CD for removal of the cross
and a CD for the addition of the bordure. As we read the existing precedents,
there has been previous discussion on whether this primary charge should
continue to be registered, but Laurel never actually ruled on the
question.
DEVICE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Áengus O'Flaherty (New name and device)
On a field patterned of a Holstein cow's hide proper, a bull's head
cabossed gules armed argent.
- Name:
- The submitter documents Aengus from the website "Irish Names
for Boys" (http://www.hylit.com/info/Names/IrishBOYSnames.html).
It is also found inO'Corrain and Maguire on pg. 148 under the heading
Óengus. O'Flaherty is documented from the website
"O'Flaherty Sphere of Influence" (http://www.angelfire.com/wa/moycullenwest/map.html).
It is also found in MacLysaght on pg. 110 under the heading Flaherty.
- Device:
- The device is being returned for non-period field treatment. Also, the
submitter should be advised that the horns as coloured has little to no
contrast against the background.
NAME IS APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
DEVICE RETURNED FOR REDRAW
Calam Stiúbhard (Device resub kingdom)
Per pale gules and argent, a death's head counterchanged.
DEVICE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Cecilia la Feconda (New Name and Device)
Or, a bunch of grapes gules slipped and leaved vert, on a quarter vert a
sun Or.
- Name:
- Cecilia is found in [De Felice, Emidio; (1986) , page 103], from
a saint of the same name from the 3rd century. La feconda is Italian
for the fertile. The submitter has approved this specific change
from ferace.
- Device:
- These arms violate the rules governing the use of cantons as a charge,
namely the appearance of augmentation. Since the quarter and canton are
artistic variations of each other, the use of a quarter must follow the same
rules as the use of a canton.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
DEVICE RETURNED FOR PRESUMPTION
Magnus Hrafnarson (New Name and Device)
Per bend sable and azure, on a bezant a hawk volant, wings elevated and
addorsed to sinister sable.
- Name:
- Both names elements are found in [Geirr Bassi Haraldsson; (1977) ].
Magnus is on page 13. We believe that Hrafnarson is the
correct genitive patronymic for Hrafn on page 11.
- Device:
- The closest armory that we found were SCA arms registered to Gwynaeth
of Math o Ddylluan, Feb '75, Sable, a bezant charged with a raven on
a branch bendwise all sable which we believe is clear by 1) the change
of tincture of half the field, and 2) the type, number and posture of the
charges on the bezant. We do not know whether the SCA arms noted here are
visually different from the submitter's arms and request that Laurel make a
visual comparison.
NAME AND DEVICE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Magnus Hrafnarson (New Badge)
Argent, two dog's heads couped addorsed sable each collared, collars
joined by a chain fracted gules, a bordure azure.
- Badge:
- We note to the submitter that dog's heads and especially the chain might
be drawn larger to improve identifiability.
BADGE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Mairead MacLabhrain (New Name and Device)
Argent, two bears statant erect respectant sable and a chest proper a
bordure azure.
- Name:
- Mairead is found in O'Corrain and Maguire on pg. 134 under the heading
Margreg. And MacLabhrain is found in Black on pg. 535 under the heading
MacLaren.
- Device:
- The position of the bears is not distinctly rampant erect or statant
erect; since we give a CD for the difference in position; we require that the
charge be drawn clearly in one or the other position, not half way in
between. Also, the charge in base is almost unidentifiable.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
DEVICE RETURNED FOR REDRAW
Mivanou merch Deicyn Maur (New name change and device resub kingdom)
Per bend sinister sable and azure, in bend a roundel between and
conjoined in fess to an increscent and a decrescent and a sun Or.
- Name:
- The submitter has documented, via Tangwystyl, all the elements as
10th/11th century spellings. Summarizing Harpy's comments, Mivanou is a
likely spelling based on spelling evolution from the13th century spelling of
Myfanwy. Merch is a reasonable spelling 10th century variation of verch.
Deicyn is an earlier form of Deykin which is a diminutive of David.
- Device:
- The submitter's previous device submission was returned for lack of
signature and redraw of the sun. She has corrected the errors.
NAME AND DEVICE APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Sheereen al-Maghrebiyya (New Name)
- Name:
The submitter wishes a Muslim name, and has provided 3 references for
the given name, transliterated either Shirin, Sheereen, or
Shireen. Her documentation does not justify the submitted
transliteration with a single "e" at the beginning of the first
name, as from the transliterations provided it appears that the two vowels
are sounded the same, and it thus appears unlikely that they would be
transliterated differently in the same word. . We are forwarding the name as
documented, and beg the comments of the College on whether Shereen
is a reasonable spelling. The submitter will accept minor changes.
al-Maghrebiyya is attested to mean "from the Far West",
where al-Maghrebi ("from the sunset" or "from the
west") refers to the entire coastal region west of Egypt and suffixed
with the feminine locative iyya as indicated in [Da'ud ibn Auda
(199?) "Arabic Names and Naming Practices" Known World Heraldic
Symposium Proceedings, Middle, AS XXVIII, June 25-26. pages 23 - 35,
page 39 ff]. We note that this name element has been transliterated as the
familiar names Marakesh and Morocco.
NAME APPROVED AND SENT TO LAUREL
Postmeeting
Except for putting away files, the meeting ended at about 5 p.m.
In service to Caid.
Madawc Caradoc, Dolphin
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Proceedings of the 1998 Known World Heraldic Symposium (1998)
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